Black conduit House sleeves problem

Michael, no problem to butt in -- that's the whole point of a forum! If tangents weren't allowed, we'd all be stuck in the same circle (get it?)

I'd be mildly surprised if there isn't liquid tight conduit in England -- there must be some equivalent. In any case, the stuff that we know works as a cambium-saver/rope-sleeve has a spirally wound steel core that provides the required structure and low-friction interface between the sleeve and the rope. The outside is coated with a plastic/rubber coating of some kind (I think some kind of PVC, but not sure). The coating is aesthetic and also may let it slide around the branch union and protect the tree a bit better than it would if it weren't there.

The part that is important is the steel core -- I've tried some all plastic alternatives and they just don't hold up well or provide a smooth enough surface for the rope to pass through. You can more easily find non-coated conduit -- just the naked steel core. Maybe you can coat that with plasti-dip to protect it and provide the same kind of properties that the rubber coating provides on the stuff we buy.

Also, there are a few different varieties of liquid-tight conduit. As you can see on my flickr site , I've tried another one and it works okay -- not as well as the black ultra-flex, but it worked. I'm not sure at all what you mean by shower hose, but the ultra-flex that I use is very flexible and does not \"remember\" or hold it's shape once deformed. The Allflex (the alternative conduit I've tried) does hold it's arc shape, which actually seemed to make it more difficult to set and keep in the branch union.

Do let us know if you try something else with success (or failure, for that matter). Sorry to be pedantic, but remember to go low and slow when you're testing new stuff -- even though this doesn't seem life-support critical, you never know how things might backfire on you . . .

Moss, thanks for the invitation . . . it sounded like a can't miss opportunity which I, unfortunately, missed. I had plans that couldn't be changed for that weekend.

However, I'll try to check the forums more often and hopefully I can make a gathering sometime soon. Virginia and points in the northern South is not a long drive from Central PA -- after all, Mason and Dixon started in Philly!

Is there a report/review/photo-site up anywhere yet?

I think I've found something similar, however I need to wait until my account is activated before I can even see the prices!

There is a choice of 13mm or 17mm ID (1/2\" or 11/16\"). I would tend to go for 17mm with my 10mm climbing rope - would you agree that more clearance is preferable?

If I had a lathe I could make up some tapered end fittings instead of the chunky screw fittings that are available!

I just measured the ID of the ultra-flex (the black liquid-tight conduit from McMaster-Carr) to be 20 mm. I think that of the two choices that you have, 17 mm is the way to fly. Do you have a link for the product you are contemplating? In any case, let us know how it works out, with some photos if possible.

17 mm is about 1/2 in of inside diameter. That's how big the inside of the flex pipe is. The outside diameter is about 3/4 in or around 19-20 mm. So it should work. Hopefully they are the same as the ones DanH. used on his. They sure worked fine for me almost 2 years or more. One is starting to show some signs of age now.
Make sure they will fit inside th pipe or you'll get stuck with 100 pieces of useless metal rings.

Here's the picture - it should be alright, but I think 10m is the shortest reel I can buy.

Michael

Hey Y'all,

Just got back from Charleston, SC with my wife and read that you all are looking for parts to make your own sleeves. If you want reply with your needs and I can figure out the costs for each one of you.

See you at the top,
Dan

PS In England call up a friendly electrictain and have him tell you what he uses for flexible conduit that is water prove.

I would be interested in about 10 sleeves for me and my climbing buddies.
(22 ft of flex conduit plus 20 end caps will make 10 sleeves)
That will keep us out of trouble and in the trees for a few years unless you climb with \"Mossy Moss\" and he eats sleeves for lunch with his high speed squirrel climbs maneuvers! He went back to the heavy duty gray sleeves!

Michael, That end cap is LOT heavier than the ones TreeTramp uses on his design and te openning looks kind of small for the rope to pass thru but it would probably work fine if that is all you can get overseas. I will try to take a photo of the ones we use FYI.

Oldtimer -- there are photos of the T&B ground cones that we use on my Flickr site ( link ).

Oldtimer, that fitting just happened to be shown in the photo - The fittings I bought (6 of them) are much simpler. However I did end up buying 10m of conduit, so I'll need to find some treeclimbers in the UK to sell them to!

One further question is how long do you typically make these friction savers? I intend to use them for SRT where the rope is fixed at ground level but also DRT. Is 2ft long enough?

Also, if you're skywalking with a split tail system would you use one of these sleeves on each end of the 'V' or are cambium savers required with their lower friction?

Michael

I was climbing a Scots Pine today, practising my techniques (switching from ascent to descent mid rope, self-locking abseil setups, using split tail systems, installing false crotches from the ground and height measuring techniques)

Anyway, looking at the indentation that the static rope made in the bark just by us hanging on it, I'm now concerned that steel conduit (albeit plastic covered) would be much harder than rope so even though there is no risk of friction burn the compression of the cambium would actually be more severe with the steel conduit.

What can we do about that?

Michael

By the way, this was the first branch I got the line over - it looked perfectly healthy from the ground but fortunately I decided to to try again for a thicker branch above. Scary eh?

michaeljspraggon wrote:

...Anyway, looking at the indentation that the static rope made in the bark just by us hanging on it, I'm now concerned that steel conduit (albeit plastic covered) would be much harder than rope so even though there is no risk of friction burn the compression of the cambium would actually be more severe with the steel conduit.

What can we do about that?

The vinyl covered steel coil conduit distributes the rope pressure enough. I use 3/4\" (inside diameter) conduit with my 11mm rope for that reason, less friction for DRT on the inside and better load distribution on the outside. A bare static rope used in a trunk-tied SRT sytem will definitely cut into a thin-barked conifer branch. I try to tie into the largest branches available on a conifer for the initial SRT entry because the bark will be thicker.

michaeljspraggon wrote:

...By the way, this was the first branch I got the line over - it looked perfectly healthy from the ground but fortunately I decided to to try again for a thicker branch above. Scary eh?

Classic. That's why it's good to examine high TIPs with binoculars from multiple angles, the rot on that branch would be visible from a side angle. In retrospect did the the foliage and outer structure on that branch give you any clues that it was compromised? If you can't get a good view of the branch you're going to hang on you have to put the SRT rope over multiple branches as a backup.

I wouldn't hang my rope on that skinny branch for an SRT ascent, healthy or otherwise.

Thanks for posting that photo, a good reminder of what to look for.
-moss

The stuff I bought is about 2/3\" ID and 13/16 OD.

That branch looked pefrectly healthy from the ground with plenty of foliage. However I thought it was too thin to use. It was also the lowest branch on that side so as you say there would be no back up. I will definitely use binoculars next time!

Michael